cassidain
Senior Insider
allow me to put you in touch with le comité du tourisme de Saint-Barth on that point.
Unvaccinated US and Canadian Traveller’s to SBH
- Thread starter KevinS
- Start date
allow me to put you in touch with le comité du tourisme de Saint-Barth on that point.
Voosh
Senior Insider
Hi! I'm never a doom & gloomer, but a survivor. We are vac'ced & get tested so much I have calluses in my nostrils. 
This caught my eye yesterday from a CDC report -
"COVID-19 in Saint Barthelemy
Level 4: Very High Level of COVID-19 in Saint Barthelemy
Key Information for Travelers to Saint Barthelemy
Source:
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices/covid-4/coronavirus-saint-barthelemy
I fervently hope this is overblown misinformation, or outdated.
Can't be too careful - most of us & extended family & friends are "essential" folks who have and do our jobs to help.
All the best to all! Just be safe.
This caught my eye yesterday from a CDC report - "COVID-19 in Saint Barthelemy
Level 4: Very High Level of COVID-19 in Saint Barthelemy
Key Information for Travelers to Saint Barthelemy
- Avoid travel to Saint Barthelemy.
- If you must travel to Saint Barthelemy, make sure you are fully vaccinated before travel.
- Because of the current situation in Saint Barthelemy, even fully vaccinated travelers may be at risk for getting and spreading COVID-19 variants."
Source:
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices/covid-4/coronavirus-saint-barthelemy
I fervently hope this is overblown misinformation, or outdated.
Can't be too careful - most of us & extended family & friends are "essential" folks who have and do our jobs to help.
All the best to all! Just be safe.
Happycamper
SBH Insider
Maybe I should have said, whoever set the rule requiring a compelling reason for unvaccinated travelers does not want St Barth to accept the extra risk embedded in an unvaccinated traveler.
didier
Senior Insider
Happy, if you read the cdc website for transmission of covid, you will see that vaccinated people are spreading the covid virus also. please lets stop this vaxx or not vaxx discussion.
Thank you, didier.
KZ1300A1
SBH Insider
True & Agreed.
stbartshopper
Senior Insider
The vax vs unvax debate never ends well.
Please let’s keep it on say a vax or covid Forum and not on this Forum.ray1:
Please let’s keep it on say a vax or covid Forum and not on this Forum.
ray1:garykool81
SBH Insider
Hi! I'm never a doom & gloomer, but a survivor. We are vac'ced & get tested so much I have calluses in my nostrils.
"COVID-19 in Saint Barthelemy
Level 4: Very High Level of COVID-19 in Saint Barthelemy
Key Information for Travelers to Saint Barthelemy
- Avoid travel to Saint Barthelemy.
- If you must travel to Saint Barthelemy, make sure you are fully vaccinated before travel.
- Because of the current situation in Saint Barthelemy, even fully vaccinated travelers may be at risk for getting and spreading COVID-19 variants."
Source:
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices/covid-4/coronavirus-saint-barthelemy
I fervently hope this is overblown misinformation, or outdated.
Can't be too careful - most of us & extended family & friends are "essential" folks who have and do our jobs to help.
All the best to all! Just be safe.
This is an accurate warning. As of the latest report from the island, St. Barts has a per capita daily new infection rate of nearly 250/100k. By comparison, this is more than double the cases impacting Florida right now in the US, which is now regarded as the viral hot spot in America.
No doubt that the island is going through exactly what we've seen elsewhere in many developed countries. Vaccine campaigns were somewhat successful enough to significantly slow or nearly eliminate the spread of COVID-19, case numbers plummeted, and then the Delta variant was introduced to the island and is burning through everyone who hasn't received a shot along with infecting even some of the vaccinated since it tends to evade vaccines better than prior variants. The Delta variant is 225% more contagious than the original COVID-19 strain and twice as likely to land an unvaccinated person in the hospital.
We're seeing these same dramatic swings upward in daily case numbers throughout much of the US and Europe, so now it has come to the island.
Jim A
Senior Insider
I think the level of the spread is the biggest key and it's not really close between the two groups. That is why many Countries (and within the US, some restos, businesses, entertainment venues, etc) are treating or soon will be treating vaccinated and non-vaccinated people differently. I think it is a smart move to make it more difficult for the non-vaccinated to enter St Barths and wonder why it wasn't done long ago as the surge would have been much less. Why take the chance? I also like allowing the compelling reason with quarantine because some people do indeed need to travel. I would go with a quarantine and no compelling reason. If someone wants to go for a month and is willing to take a test and then quarantine for a week upon arrival they seem a low enough risk to take a chance on to me. I have no issue with people deciding not to get vaccinated and I also have no issue with making them jump through some additional hoops.
garykool81
SBH Insider
Happycamper
SBH Insider
Didier, KZ1300A1, StBartshopper, I'm a little confused by your comments wanting to shut down discussion related to the vaccine. This thread's actual topic is the vaccine and how it is now part of the St Barth entry requirements. I'm simply pointing out the obvious, that people who are vaccinated have a decreased chance of carrying the virus, which is why St Barth requires visitors to be vax'ed. If it makes you uncomfortable to read or discuss with travelers about how and why the vaccine is now part of St Barth's entry requirements, then maybe skip over this thread. I don't think you seriously want to hide from potential visitors that the vaccine is now required for casual visitors? They're going to find out at entry anyway aren't they?
Picture vaccinated people as logs and the unvaccinated people as kindling that are 10X easier to set on fire and that, randomly, someone is tossing lit matches into the group. If most people are vaccinated, most of the time, the lit matches bounce off of logs and just go out. If most people are not vaccinated, then the lit matches fall on bits of kindling, which lite and then spreads to more kindling and then also to the logs. It isn't political, or even science. It is just math. Math doesn't care about feelings, rights, equity, morals or any of the things that 'debates' tend to fixate on.
The fact that vaccinated people can also catch, carry, and transmit the virus is important to know, but the numbers involved are a different order of magnitude so does not invalidate the point that vaccinated are dramatically less likely to catch, carry and transmit. People wearing seatbelts sometimes die in car crashes, yet I still wear my seatbelt. Seatbelts help survivability of car crashes by only about 2X. The vaccine is more like 10X reduction in sickness.
I'm not trying to be controversial and sorry if you read my comments that way. I'm actually trying to be Spock-like and straight forward logical. Here is the rule...Here is the reason for the rule.... Silencing either of those points seems to harm potential St Barth travelers.
Picture vaccinated people as logs and the unvaccinated people as kindling that are 10X easier to set on fire and that, randomly, someone is tossing lit matches into the group. If most people are vaccinated, most of the time, the lit matches bounce off of logs and just go out. If most people are not vaccinated, then the lit matches fall on bits of kindling, which lite and then spreads to more kindling and then also to the logs. It isn't political, or even science. It is just math. Math doesn't care about feelings, rights, equity, morals or any of the things that 'debates' tend to fixate on.
The fact that vaccinated people can also catch, carry, and transmit the virus is important to know, but the numbers involved are a different order of magnitude so does not invalidate the point that vaccinated are dramatically less likely to catch, carry and transmit. People wearing seatbelts sometimes die in car crashes, yet I still wear my seatbelt. Seatbelts help survivability of car crashes by only about 2X. The vaccine is more like 10X reduction in sickness.
I'm not trying to be controversial and sorry if you read my comments that way. I'm actually trying to be Spock-like and straight forward logical. Here is the rule...Here is the reason for the rule.... Silencing either of those points seems to harm potential St Barth travelers.
MTBH
SBH Member
Nicely articulated Happy.
Happycamper
SBH Insider
Agreed! It would be great to see everyday the number of deaths in EU and USA along with the calculated risk of death by age group of the vaccinated versus the unvaccinated. My belief is that they stopped reporting the raw data because if you blindly compare the vaccinated, who were mostly older, versus the unvaccinated who were mostly younger, then you would get the wrong impression. For example, 75+ aged people are around a thousand times more likely to die from covid than a group of 20 year olds. So, even though vaccinating a group 75+ year olds may reduce their risk of dying by a lot (they are less likely to catch it and even if they catch it they get less sick) but they are still more likely to die from Covid than unvaccinated 20 somethings. So the 'brilliant' vaccine can be positioned as not so great, if you don't factor in which groups were vaccinated and when.
Another factor adding to the confusion, is what I call the superman effect. Some people, when vaccinated, feel that they are now superman and invincible and drop all the cautions they used to take. When they get sick, people attribute it to a failure of the vaccine when it is really a failure of their understanding the vaccine only reduces their chances of catching Covid rather than fully eliminating it.
I would prefer that the CDC publish more data, rather than less, and if it confuses some people then so be it. We can't protect everyone from faulty thinking, but by publishing the data, those who are willing to work through it can find the safest path if they want to. By picking and choosing which data to gather and publish, the CDC looks like a political agency and that helps no one in the long run.
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stbartshopper
Senior Insider
Here we go- stay away from vax vs. no vax. to be considered different.
Who sang ‘I’m Only Human?’
Who sang ‘I’m Only Human?’
When Covid first got going and people were starting to quarantine at home a friend of mine who works at a large university sent me a picture of Charles Darwin with the caption "It's OK if you don't want to quarantine". That caption could now be edited to say It's OK if you don't want to get vaccinated. I've given up being upset at the non-vaxers. Delta will sort things out.
didier
Senior Insider
Happy, I am sure your comments are appreciated by many, but all the facts are not in about a lot of things to do with the covid 19 vaccines. Moderna just announced today that they will be adding a 3rd booster shot to try and get a handle on the many variants. since we know for a fact that some people who are vaccinated can indeed contract covid and spread the disease, its too early to pat yourself on the back if you are vaccinated.
there are pros and cons on both sides of this issue, the main focus of this forum is to help travelers who wish to travel here. focusing on the vaccine itself can make the forum a place for bikering between the vaxxers and the non vaxxers. this should be a pleasant place to visit for both.
